1. THE
AUDITOR GENERAL REPORTED THAT SHE WAS UNABLE TO DETERMINE THE TOTAL COST OF
THE GUN REGISTRY FROM THE INFORMATION PROVIDED BY THE DEPARTMENT OF JUSTICE.
A. The information the
Department provided states that by 2001-02 it has spent about $688 million
on the Program and collected about $59 million in revenues after refunds. We
believe that this information does not fairly present the cost of the Program
to the government.
Source:
Report of the Auditor General of Canada – December
2002, Paragraph 10.2 – Page 1.
http://www.oag-bvg.gc.ca/domino/reports.nsf/html/20021210ce.html/$file/20021210ce.pdf
B.
Mr. Chair, we asked the department to give us a financial statement
of the costs of the program. We wanted to audit that. It was a very simple,
straight financial audit. We had great difficulty getting the information in
the form that we asked for. We had great difficulty getting complete
information. That is what we were reporting to you today.
Source: Testimony
of Mrs. Sheila Fraser, Auditor General of Canada before
the House of Commons Standing Committee on Public Accounts – Monday,
February 24, 2003 [unedited blues].
2.
THE AUDITOR GENERAL REPORTED THAT THE JUSTICE DEPARTMENT FAILED TO REPORT THE “WIDER
COSTS” OF THE GUN REGISTRY AS REQUIRED BY THE GOVERNMENT’S REGULATORY
POLICY.
In
2000, the Department of Justice estimated that by 2004-05 it would spend at
least $1 billion on the Program and collect $140 million in fees after
refunds. This amount does not include all financial impacts on the government.
The Department also did not report to Parliament on the wider costs of the
Program as required by the government's regulatory policy.
Source: Report of the Auditor General of Canada
– December 2002, Paragraph 10.3 – Page 1.
3. THE AUDITOR GENERAL
REPORTED THAT THE DEPARTMENT OF JUSTICE FAILED TO REPORT THE COSTS OF
ENFORCING THE FIREARMS ACT.
Further, in its Regulatory Impact Analysis Statements the Department
of Justice did not provide Parliament with an estimate of all the major
additional costs that would be incurred. This disclosure was required by the
government's regulatory policy. The costs incurred by the provincial and
territorial agencies in enforcing the legislation were not reported. In
addition, costs that were incurred by firearms owners, firearms clubs,
manufacturers, sellers, and importers and exporters of firearms, in their
efforts to comply with the legislation were not reported.
Source: Report of the
Auditor General of Canada – December 2002, Paragraph 10.29 – Page 6.
4.
THE JUSTICE MINISTER SAID THAT PARLIAMENT WILL HAVE TO WAIT UNTIL FALL
FOR HIM TO TABLE HIS “CONSOLIDATED REPORT” ON THE TOTAL COST OF THE
GUN REGISTRY.
A.
The KPMG audit did not, as Cauchon had indicated
it would, tally costs borne by other government departments information
Auditor General Sheila Fraser complained she was unable to get because the
Justice Department failed to gather it. Canadians will have to wait until fall for that figure,
Cauchon said. "We're working
together to make sure we will have the consolidated report and I'm sure we
will be able to table the consolidated report this fall,"
Source:
The Moncton Times and Transcript, “Gun registry questions remain
unanswered; Two reports on gun registry don't answer key questions, say
critics” – Page C12, February 4, 2003.
B. The reports tabled by Mr. Cauchon
yesterday do not provide the overall costs of
the program, and the Justice Minister told reporters that tally may not come
until fall -- long after government and opposition MPs are asked to approve a
new gun registry budget.
Source: The
National Post – “Review finds $400M lost on
gun registry: 'Unnecessarily complex': Money spent on databases will never be
recovered” - Page A4, February 4, 2003.
5. JUSTICE
MINISTER CAUCHON SAID THAT HE “TOTALLY” ACCEPTS ALL THE
RECOMMENDATIONS OF THE AUDITOR GENERAL.
A.
Mr. Speaker, we totally accept the Auditor General's
recommendations. It is sound policy. The question is could we do more, could
we do better? Yes, we can do better. We are firmly committed to do so.
Source:
Justice Minister Martin Cauchon – December 4, 2002, Hansard – Pages
2204.
B.
However, the Auditor General stated, and I agree, that we need to
do better. We have to get the administration of this important
public safety program back on track and do it in a cost-effective manner that
Canadians can support. …
I understand the concerns expressed in the Auditor General's report and
in the House. I have made a commitment to the House to carefully examine
the costs and the administration of the program, to make improvements and to
be transparent in my efforts to do these things. I am fulfilling my
commitments.
Source:
Justice Minister Martin Cauchon – December 12, 2002, Hansard –
Pages 2591-2592.
C.
Beyond that, as the Minister pointed out, we have agreed to accept all of
the recommendations of the Auditor General in her report.
Those recommendations do go to more transparent reporting and we intend to
comply with those and I think we've followed that—
Source:
Testimony of the Deputy Minister of
Justice Morris Rosenberg before the House of Commons Standing Committee on
Public Accounts – Monday, February 24, 2003 [unedited blues]
6. THE
AUDITOR GENERAL RECOMMENDS THAT THE CANADIAN FIREARMS PROGRAM HAVE ITS OWN “BUSINESS
LINE” IN THE MAIN ESTIMATES.
One thing I think that would have
perhaps avoided some of the confusion that has occurred recently is, for
instance, there's mention of $113 million of planned spending in the report of
Plans and Priorities. It would have also been helpful, I think, if there
had been a breakdown under that to say how much was in the main estimates--$47
million--and $72 million expected in supplementary estimates. I think that
would have cleared up some of the confusion
that's been in the House this past week because the planned spending included
both main estimates and planned supplementary estimates.
Source:
Testimony
of Mrs. Sheila Fraser, Auditor General of Canada before the House of
Commons Standing Committee on Public Accounts – Monday, February 24, 2003
[unedited blues].
7.
JUSTICE MINISTER ADMITS THAT NO ONE CAN TELL WHAT IS TO BE SPENT ON THE
GUN CONTROL PROGRAM BY LOOKING AT THE MAIN ESTIMATES.
If I may, Mr. Chairman, I just would like to tell you
that the report on plan and priorities that we have tabled for the fiscal year
2002-2003 is a report where you find exactly the numbers to be invested in the
program for the year 2002-2003, and you find it in a separate item.
Of course, as we said before--and I guess as has been mentioned as well
by the Auditor General in a previous year--we were respecting the rules of
Treasury Board and reporting to one item and when you looked at that item,
obviously it doesn't tell you what amount exactly would be spent for the Gun
Control Program.
Source:
Testimony of Justice Minister Martin
Cauchon before the House of Commons Standing Committee on Public Accounts
– Monday, February 24, 2003 [unedited blues].
8. THE
AUDITOR GENERAL REPORTED THAT THE CANADIAN FIREARMS PROGRAM IS A “MAJOR
CROWN PROJECT” AND REPORTING REQUIREMENTS TO PARLIAMENT WERE NOT MET.
The issue we brought up is that this program was
classified as a major crown project and there were certain reporting
requirements that should have been met. There should have been details of a
description of the project, the various departments and agencies that were
involved in it, the total expenditures to date and planned expenditures for
future years, major milestones and progress reports and other things. So as a
major crown project, which the firearms program was, this reporting should
have been in the departmental performance report.
Source:
Testimony of Mrs. Sheila Fraser,
Auditor General of Canada before the House of Commons Standing Committee
on Public Accounts – Monday, February 24, 2003 [unedited blues].
9. JUSTICE
MINISTER CAUCHON TABLED THE MAIN ESTIMATES WITHOUT A SEPARATE “BUSINESS
LINE” FOR THE CANADIAN FIREARMS PROGRAM.
Main Estimates – 2003-2004 – Justice
Department [See Page 15-5]
http://www.tbs-sct.gc.ca/est-pre/20032004/002_e.pdf
Contributions to the provinces and territories for
the Canadian Firearms Program = $18,000,000
NOTE:
This is the only reference to the Firearms Program in the entire 341-page
Estimates document tabled in Parliament February 26, 2003
Treasury Board News Release – February 26,
2003
http://www.tbs-sct.gc.ca/media/nr-cp/2003/0226A_e.asp
- $74 million for the Canadian Firearms Centre -
Department of Justice. The 2003-2004 Main Estimates will include a total of
$113.1 million for the Canadian Firearms Centre for the first year's
implementation of the action plan;
10. JUSTICE
MINISTER CAUCHON RELEASED DETAILED SPENDING ESTIMATES FOR THE GUN REGISTRY TO
THE MEDIA ONE MONTH BEFORE HE WILL TABLE THIS INFORMATION IN PARLIAMENT.
Martin
Cauchon, the Justice Minister, faced renewed accusations yesterday that he has
failed to provide Parliament with clear financial information on the
controversial national firearms program after his department requested another
$172-million to keep it running. The
funding request was part of the federal government's annual spending estimates,
which it tabled in the Commons yesterday. Opposition
critics attacked the government for failing to provide a proper accounting of
the program, including cost breakdowns, despite being urged to as recently as
this week by Sheila Fraser, the Auditor-General. The complete cost estimates are
revealed in a government news release, which, unlike the estimates, are not
tabled in Parliament. "They
continue to keep Parliament in the dark," said Alliance MP John Williams,
chairman of the Commons public accounts committee. "I have never heard of
us being able to appropriate money through a news release."
The
news release says the Justice department will spend $113-million on the national
firearms program in fiscal year 2003-2004. Mr. Cauchon also tabled supplementary
estimates in Parliament yesterday, which make a specific request for $59-million
to fund the program to the end of the current fiscal year. Combined, the
total request for firearms program money is $172-million. Mike Murphy, a
spokesman for Mr. Cauchon, said the more detailed breakdown contained in the
news release will be tabled in Parliament in late March.
Source: The
National Post – “Gun
registry needs another $172-million” - Page A4,
February 27, 2003.
NOTE:
This is a copy of the document that was handed out to the media by the
Justice Minister's Press Secretary, Mike Murphy.
The same information was not made available to Members of Parliament.
http://www.cssa-cila.org/garryb/publications/cauchon'sexplanationofestimates2003-04.pdf
11.
THE JUSTICE MINISTER’S SPENDING ESTIMATES FOR 2003-2004 INCREASED BY $18.1
MILLION SINCE THEIR MARCH 21, 2002 ESTIMATES.
The Justice
Department’s Report on Plans and Priorities for 2002-2003 estimated that the
Canadian Firearms Program would cost $95 million in fiscal year 2003-2004
(See page 11).
http://www.tbs-sct.gc.ca/est-pre/20022003/jus-jus/jus0203rpp02_e.asp
The Treasury Board News Release dated February
26, 2003, states: The 2003-2004 Main
Estimates will include a total of $113.1 million for the Canadian
Firearms Centre for the first year's implementation of the action plan;
http://www.tbs-sct.gc.ca/media/nr-cp/2003/0226A_e.asp
12.
ON DECEMBER 5, 2002 THE HOUSE OF COMMONS “REPUDIATED” THE
CANADIAN FIREARMS PROGRAM BY UNANIMOUSLY REFUSING THE JUSTICE MINISTER’S
REQUEST FOR $72 MILLION IN FUNDING. NOTHING
HAS REALLY CHANGED IN THE LAST THREE MONTHS - PARLIAMENT IS STILL BEING KEPT IN
THE DARK!
Excerpt from
Hansard for Wednesday, February 12, 2003 – Pages 3471-3472:
http://www.parl.gc.ca/37/2/parlbus/chambus/house/debates/058_2003-02-12/HAN058-E.htm
Mr.
Roger Gallaway (Sarnia—Lambton, Lib.): Mr. Speaker, I rise on a question of privilege arising
from the justice minister's response to the question posed by the member for
Huron--Bruce during yesterday's question period. I will be brief, as others may
feel as I do that this is a matter of extreme importance to the House's overview
and approval of public moneys, that is, the public purse. The minister stated:
“ --up until the approval of the supplementary estimates, we were moving with
what we call cash management.... The program is running at minimum cost but we
are able to fulfill our duty.” That raises, I submit, an important question of privilege.
On
Thursday, December 5 of last year, on a motion by the member for
Pictou—Antigonish—Guysborough, the House reduced by an amount of
approximately $72 million the supplementary estimates on votes 1a and 5a. The
House agreed and voted on that reduction. The government has attempted to
manipulate the public perception of this act by spinning the myth that it was
the justice minister who withdrew those supplementary estimates.
That
$72 million had been dedicated to the national firearms program. That motion of
reduction carried in the House. That motion was the unequivocally clear
expression of this chamber to disallow those moneys to the minister. To state
otherwise would be patently false and misleading. The record is clear.
There
is an unequivocal principle in our House that the estimates are the financial
expressions of government policy. In brief, the approval of the estimates is the
signal to bring on the adoption and consideration of the appropriation bill. In
fact, Beauchesne's sixth edition, paragraph 968(1) states: “The concurrence by
the House in the Estimates is an Order of the House to bring in a bill, known as
the Appropriation Bill, based thereon.”
By
that December motion to reduce the Minister of Justice's estimates for the
firearms program, the House laid down two principles. First, it ordered that no
moneys for the national firearms program be included in the appropriation bill.
Second, it clearly stated its disapproval, this chamber's disapproval, of the
national firearms program. It repudiated the program by ordering no more money
for it.
